User talk:Hrodulf Archive1

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Hi.

edit Re:SRV

Since it looks like you make most of your edits logged out I don't know if you will see this, but this is a response to the comments you made on VFD regarding your SRV template.

  • Length is most certainly an issue. That is why the second line of the NRV template askes one to expand the tagged page into a full article. We just simply can't deal with the shear volume of half-assed stubs that get submitted by people who just don't care about making a quality article. Rarely if ever will someone else devote their time to salvaginf someone else's article. If we really think someone might, though, we add the "rewrite" tag.
  • For articles that have some redeeming value, we use a set of tags that gives a longer period of time to work on articles, such as "expansion" "fix" and "ugly." Even here, though, it is primarily the responsibility of the orginal author to care enough to make the page worth keeping. Otherwise the article's value is overshadowed by its faults so that there is no net redeeming value.
  • NRV is usually only supposed to be used by users that have been around a while, have good judgement, and are trusted. When NRVed articles are deleted an admin goes through each one and reads them, makes an assessment on their value, checks to see if anyone has trid to improve them and makes sure that the user who tagged the page is legit. NRV isn't my main job, but I have done it myself and I can assure you we do catch it when pages are wrongly NRVed.
  • Templates who have a comedic value and which will be used widely enough to justify having their own entry (rather than just being hardcoded in) may be created without permission. Templates that have a functional purpose need to be cleared with the people who use them to maintain the site. Templates that are designed to irritate or aggravate the people who spend their time trying to maintain and improve the site are not a good idea. They violate rule #2 of uncyclopedia: "don't be a dick."
  • If you wish to discuss maintanence policy, go to Forum:Village_Dump, though I suspect that the experience and frequent users will not share your opinion.
  • If you want to create a short article for others to contribute to and it is not of suficient quality to stay, create it as a sub-page of your user page and then post it on Uncyclopedia:Pee_Review.

---QuillRev. Isra (talk) 02:02, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

That's fine, but I believe putting down "no redeeming value" on a page when it is a length issue is inappropriate. Tagging someone's work as "no redeeming value" just because it's a one liner, even if it's funny, is counter-constructive and constitutes bullying, IMHO. I think the SRV experience was valuable just because it brought about a conversation on this subject. I don't believe that would have happened otherwise. I don't have a problem with deleting material where it's warranted (for example, I doubt the 'nigga stole my bike' page will ever amount to anything). I just think the NRV tag is needlessly offensive. And you're entitled to think that's a stupid position. I just don't understand why it's necessary to say someone's writing has no value when it just needs to be longer and more substantive. That doesn't mean the idea is bad. And it doesn't mean that their work needs to be effectively vandalized by an ugly, offensive tag that they're not even allowed to remove.

RudolfRadna, 02:28, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

Quick note: if someone leaves a message here on your talk page, you can respond here, not on their page, since when someone leaves you a message they will usually watchlist the page. Also: please sign your comments either using the signature button or by typing four tildes (~) into the edit box. The tildes get replaced by your signature.
I didn't come up with the name of NRV. I did change the text, though, which was actually designed to offensive before that. So yes, we have had this discussion multiple times. Nevertheless the template is designed to discourage the bad behavior of making pages that do not have enough substance to have any value as encyclopedia entries. If your page gets tagged with NRV you are allowed to remove it, you just have to follow the directions on the template and expand the article into something worth keeping. We are never going to ban someone for removing the NRV tag when they make a good faith effort to improve a page. But if someone is unwilling to make their page an acceptable part of the site, then it is necessary to "effectivel vandalize" it, and if it being ugly and offensive is what it takes to spur them to action, so be it. ---QuillRev. Isra (talk) 02:30, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

My only point is that I believe a tag that says to the effect "this page is too short. Lengthen it into an encyclopedia article of at least a few paragraphs, hopefully with some illustrations and references, or it will be deleted" is a more apporpriate way to handle this situation. Saying someone's writing has "no value" itself has no value, unless it's truly justified. If you think NRV isn't being misused in this regard, you're entitled to that opinion. I disagree. --RudolfRadna 02:40, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

Btw, I've noted at http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Forum:VFD that one problem is that material that shouldn't have been deleted was getting deleted, so it's clear that there have been issues with the way people are using VFD and NRV. I am optimistic that these problems can be fixed, and am particularly pleased that one of the criteria for the standard use of deletion and NRV regarding humor states, to the effect, that the test is not whether the individual user who wants to VFD or NRV finds the page funny, but whether it has humor potential. I think some users have been using NRV just to zap things they think are stupid, leading to the problem of stuff getting tagged that shouldn't. --RudolfRadna 20:11, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

You may also want to take a peek at Forum:NRVs please as the NRV question is being addressed more directly there? --Carlb 23:03, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

edit Swiss Navy Knife

I'll restore, but only if you expand it. Tompkinssig Smallturtle t o m p k i n s  blah. ﺞوﻦ וףה ՃՄ ண்ஸ ފއހ วอฏม +տ trade websites 21:42, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

I've decided to create it on my user page. I didn't originate the idea, Matt Kurz did, so anyway, you don't need to restore it. I'm still a little confused as to why this was a delete situation rather than an NRV however, since I don't see what was wrong with the stub, and just wiping the stuff is interfering with users working on the stubs. --RudolfRadna 21:47, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

edit Thanks for trying to save swiss navy

"i just added it like 1/2 hour ago with the intention of fleshing it ou, hence the stub template... but of course you knew that... no shit about the deletionist thing... who'd think it would be worse here than in jimboland?"

(Above unsigned, but probably Matt Kurz) --RudolfRadna 15:05, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

edit Huffing

Nothing that is saved underneath your userspace will be huffed by an admin. It's only the stuff written in the public areas that can be NRV'd or deleted outright. ~ T. (talk) 14:24, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

Good point, I forgot. Thanks. --Hrodulf 14:26, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

edit rebel

C'mon join my rebel forces. This place sucks because it is offensive to my favorite things (Star Wars yugioh skateboarding). UncyclopediA sucks! 02:37, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

If you don't like the site, just don't go there. I don't like the christianity wiki or the white nationalist wiki. I don't go there. What's the point of trying to "take down" uncyclopedia? It won't work and other people are entitled to have different interests and opinions than you are, you know. Most of the material on this site is not even meant to be taken literally, and is just a joke. If you're serious, you're really just making yourself look silly (which is, I suppose, what this place is for anyway, so, carry on I guess) . . . --Hrodulf 11:43, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

Dude, this site is harsh. It has seriously offended me. It is racist and it makes fun of different religions. But, I guess you are right. UncyclopediA sucks! 20:28, 19 May 2006 (UTC)


edit Confused

Are you Hinoa4? If not, why not? --Frogturd 14:14, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, I'm not Hinoa4. As for why not, I'm afraid I don't know. Fate I rather imagine. --Hrodulf 14:20, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

edit I'm impressed

You came all the way back, to correct a typo? I've been busy trying to save pages from deletion. Just to be sure I've saved copies ;-).
I really must get a life, but this is addictive isn't it?
So....is this a full time job for you guys, or just voluntary?
--Frogturd 21:49, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

This is social activity for me, an opportunity to talk to and collaborate creatively with people. And to pretend that I'm Hal 9000 occasionally. Addictive, yes, but not as bad for you as chocolate or Rush Limbaugh. --Hrodulf 21:58, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

edit Proposal for Image Review Process

Hi again. As you will have seen, I have set up a page in my userspace which I propose to be a kind of image review service. I noticed you placed a link to it on your userpage before I could even start to promote it! Man that's fast. Anyway, thanks for that.

Basically, the idea will be to try and cut down on some of the bitterness which has been going on at VFP recently, probably relating to quality of some of the pictures posted there. People could submit their ideas/early versions of proposed images for VFP etc, and I, and any other kind users out there, could give some helpful advice that won't be too harsh so as to put people off.

I plan to start mentioning this gradually, starting with bringing it up in the chat room tommorow and posting a topic in the Village Dump. Eventually the goal will be to perhaps make it more prominent, with a link in the Community Portal, on VFP etc. But for now, I will see how it goes.

I would be very grateful for any feedback on the idea and any possible references to anyone who would find it useful. Thanks a lot.

PS. I'm liking what you're doing with the Ask Hal thing: I think it's great! --Hindleyite | PL | CUN | Converse 20:45, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Glad you like the Ask Hal feature. I'm going to see how far this thing goes. Should be interesting and fun. I put the link on my userpage for my own use. I don't have any images to nominate right now, but I may in the future. The idea seems to be good but I don't know if it will work unless you put it in the village dump and let people know about it.

--Hrodulf 20:59, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

edit thanks

but I have been here for about a year, just not very active. Any complaint in particular?

RaRanax 21:28, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

I flagged you as a new user because you started a talk page. I assume users who start a userpage or talk page are new. I removed you from the new user list since you said you're not new. This is a project I'm doing to try to track the new users and maybe do a better job assimilating them into the site so that we get some new content in here. --Hrodulf 21:33, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

edit Help¡

How i can do to make my new wikia, in the message i was can read, Contact the editor: mail: http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Hrodulf wiki: http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/User:Hrodulf, Ah?.--The Little and left cero JALAJANDRO 19:07, 27 May 2006 (UTC)


edit Thanks for the message!

Thanks for the greeting message! Here is my first article to Uncyclopedia, A Million Little Feces tell me what you think! The Fading Light 01:34, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

It's a good start, but it's mostly based on South Park. You should just type whatever comes to mind and make up some original ideas. Here's what happened when I tried: [[1]] Also, you'll probably have a better experience if you compose on your userpage subspace as recommended in the howto document. The admins here tend to have issues about article quality and their standards can be somewhat discouragingly high (well, discouraging to me anyway). --Hrodulf 01:40, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

I've added about a million more tweaks but the article is still heavily influenced by South Park, I really need some help. The Fading Light 02:42, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

edit Re: Uber Goober

That template is wonderful, and for it I thank you. May I inquire how I put such a marvelous and unique piece of equipment to work? I've looked all over the help pages but just can't find where it says how to insert a template.--TKF 05:04, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

edit League of Benson again

Leagueofbenson

you're in the league! Benson 12:16, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Awesome! Thanks for bringing some excitement and enthuasiasm to this dull place! --Hrodulf 13:46, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

edit League of Benson

Benson invites you to join the League of Benson. Post your response in Benson's talk page. Benson 21:46, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

edit Twas a joke

OK!!!! BENSON FORGIVES YOU!!! -- Tinymooose.gif » Sir Savethemooses Grand Commanding Officer ... holla atcha boy» 18:31, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, I figured it was a joke, but I also thought maybe there was a kernel of not a joke-ness behind it, lol. I'm not mad about it or anything and it was actually pretty funny. --Hrodulf 18:32, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

edit What... are... you... doing?

( 'scribed from dump) Hrol, I'm in the right mindset to ban you right now. If you'd read the beginner's guide, you'd well know that a lack of response does not imply consent on the part of the administrators. In the future, don't do things like this again, especially considering that the last link has NO use whatsoever, the middle link is of questionable use, and the tone and usefulness of the first article is certainly in contention. If you need admin approval that badly. bother one of us on the talk page.--ShroomsShroom!Gay2Sir Flammable KUN Prince%21.gif (Na Naaaaa...)Gay2Shroom!Shroomirror 21:08, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

If anyone has any objections to the article, I'll make whatever changes are desired. And if you want the links wiped, I'll wipe them. I was trying to be proactive and I thought what I was doing was useful. You're entitled to disagree. If you want it to be taken down, it will be taken down, and if you want it changed, I'll change it. --Hrodulf 22:19, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

I added a more detailed response in the Village Dump forum, and I suggest we continue this conversation there. --Hrodulf 22:47, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

edit Ask Hal 9000

Erm... I like the idea, but, erm... has there actually been any discussion on whether to have it or not? If that is the case, I suggest you pop an article into the Village Dump, and see if people would be interested in replacing Ask Cthulhu with it. Cheers! --Olipro Icons-flag-gb Anchor (Harass) 10:41, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Why don't we leave Ask Cthulhu as it is, and use Ask Hal for computer related and technical questions? That way Cthulhu can remain as the sites favourite Agony Aunt (in every sense) with Hal 9000 becoming a demonic Tech Support. Think theres potential there for them both..... -- Sir Mhaille Icons-flag-gb (talk to me)
I will open a village dump forum on it. I never planned to replace Ask Cuthulu with this. I thought this would be an addition, not a replacement. This was an evolution of an idea I had, which was originally supposed to be a Hal9000 themed main page reskin. I lacked the wikiformatting skills to actually create a test page however, so I decided on this idea instead. I think it has humor potential, the idea is to be funny with the answers, while staying "in character" as Hal from the 2001 film (I'm not sure about Hal in 2010 since the events of 2001 were deleted from his memory. The 2001 Hal is a much more interesting character). In any case, we can talk it over in the dump and work all of this out (if nothing else, I got a kick out of making the image with the Discovery systems TLAs replaced with "NRV" and "GOTM" . . . .
--Hrodulf 10:57, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
And, Olipro, I'm sorry if I was too bold in changing the UnNews template to include Ask Hal 9000, but the page won't get any questions if people can't find it. Again, we can discuss this in the Village Dump forum topic I've created: Forum:Ask Hal 9000.
--Hrodulf 11:02, 23 May 2006 (UTC)


edit HAL 9000 for President

I love it! Zimbuddha Rev. Zim (Talk) Get saved! 20:52, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Glad you like the article. I like writing it! Thanks for the support and let me know what you think of any future developments. For example, I was uncertain if I should go with the cybersex gag, but it seemed funny to me. Let me know if there's anything in the Hal 9000 article you particularly like or dislike, it will make the article better in the future.--Hrodulf 20:54, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

edit A few things

Hello again. First of all Thanks for submitting some stuff to image review and supporting the idea while it's still getting off the ground. I appreciate this.
I've noticed your recent project to promote How to get started editing Uncyclopedia to new users and have found something you might find useful. I don't know if you know about it, but there's a special page listing edits by new users here. Perhaps this could be used in conjunction with the List of New Users to help promote your article and help out newbies.
By the way, I was going to nominate you at Noob of the month, because I think you deserve something for your fantastic efforts since you arrived here. Ask Hal 9000 and your efforts to help newbies would have put you in good stead if it were earlier in the month. However, 1) it seems too late (you have been here longer than the designated period that defines a 'noob') and 2) Hardwick is a nailed on cert this month, what with there only being five days left. Still, a big thumbs up from me on your work so far.

Oh, and have a pie to help sustain you on keeping up the good work. --Hindleyite | PL | CUN | Converse 14:48, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the kind words, and don't worry about the NotM issue; the point is to make uncyclopedia better. If that results in awards, that's a good thing since it encourages other people to contribute constructively to the site, if it doesn't then that doesn't interfere with what I'm trying to do here, so that's ok also. This is part of the reason why when people help me with one of my pages, I give them credit for it. Not only is it the right thing to do it encourages them to help me, which is important, since I don't know a lot about wiki editing yet. There's no way I could have coded the console on the Ask Hal article, and it really adds a lot to it I think. I don't mind the fonts not being authentic to the movie. The overall effect works very well.

Also, thanks for the new user edit information, I was going into recent changes and typing 'N U' in my search box to find the new talk and user pages. This project is just an experiment, I remember someone saying "hey wikia can we have a new user log, hint hint" and I realized this probably won't happen so this is an attempt to do it manually. Better than nothing.

I think we need to make the n00bs feel like we care that they bothered to come here and help us out, and keep track of them so we can tell how successful we're being at encouring people to be active users. If we don't have a n00b list, there's no way to tell how successful we're being, because we don't know who the n00bs are, or how many of them there are. If we want lots of new ideas and articles, we need n00bs and a lot of them, and that's why I decided to see what I could do about studying our retention rate. I actually got the idea because of Frogturd's apparent abandoning of his/her userpage. We kind of mishandled that, so I thought maybe I'd try to avoid that sort of thing in the future.
--Hrodulf 14:57, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Yes, with regards to Frogturd, we did kind of mishandle that there slightly, but he was being a bit awkward. I agree that Uncyclopedia is a bit daunting at first: we need some sort of 'n00b-friendly zone' that makes them feel welcome. I think perhaps all that documentation 'HTBFANJS' and the beginner's guide is a bit daunting for newbies - a page which digests all this under 1500 words might be good. Take a look at Wikipedia: they've got a welcoming committee. At the moment, it seems Todd and Mhaille are doing all this at Uncyclopedia. If they're happy doing this, fine, because we're nowhere near as large a wiki. But it's small things like a personal welcome message which make new users feel more comfortable.
Personally, I'm happy to adopt n00bs as per the Adopt a n00b campaign but I just don't know how to go about it. Also, not every n00b is aware of this project, so will never sign up. I'm not going to go into this much further right now, I'm just kicking a few ideas around. But I like it when a user such as you comes along and actively seeks to help/promote the wiki. After all, that's what we all want, right? --Hindleyite | PL | CUN | Converse 15:18, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Well, you may have noticed that I've edited the n00b talk pages with a template-reference to two canned messages referring them to the howto page. I did this to make it quicker. But I realize that now I can edit your Adopt a Noob link into my canned "templates," and all the n00bs I tagged will get your Adopt a N00b info. And every new one I tag will get it also. This seems to be a flexible way to do this. I think we should try working together on this, and we can come up with some sort of approach that works
--Hrodulf 15:22, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Ok, I put the Adopt a Noob, and the New User List, as links in my talk page message "templates." I know this is risky because a vandal could attack my templates, but you can see the advantages. Now if we want to change our approach, or have a new idea, we don't have to individually communicate with hundreds of people again. We can reach them en masse. Of course, we shouldn't change it too much, or else it will get silly, but for things like this, I think it's appropriate.

And like I said to Isra when I was still a n00b and got into a huge argument with him over NRV http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Isra1337/archive4#VFD_Forum:

"You have now made your views known publicly. People can vote on them if they like them. Mostly you will find that the way things are done are time-tested and the result of pretty broad consensus, so I wouldn't hold out much hope.
---QuillRev. Isra (talk) 03:16, 4 April 2006 (UTC)
I'm just trying to make uncyclopedia a better place. If I didn't care, I wouldn't have bothered participating in the process. Whether or not people agree with my ideas is out of my control, and whatever happens will happen. This sort of thing seems to have a way of working itself out with time.
--RudolfRadna 04:34, 4 April 2006 (UTC)
Understood. We are all trying to make it a better place. And, indeed, things will work themselves
out in time. And don't worry to much: we were all noobs once, so when you make mistakes they will be forgiven and eventually you will become more familiar with the system around here.
---QuillRev. Isra (talk) 04:40, 4 April 2006 (UTC)"

Those comments ended a particularly bitter argument. Following this, in the forum "NRV's Please," my ideas actually were partially implemented to a certain extent in a change in the wording of the NRV template, showing that if you approach these situations in the right way, and participate, you can make a difference, even if you're a n00b. The HowTo page itself is another resource that only exists because I went to the admins with a complaint; they didn't resolve the complaint, but it inspired me to take action. And I suppose that's how a wiki is supposed to work.

Anyway, like you said, all I've ever been trying to do from the beginning, is to make the site better. And sometimes to do that, there's been tension, unpleasantness, and even outright aggression. But I think I've been doing the right thing, overall, with perhaps a few blunders, but more or less, it's been working out. Like I've said before, I don't think the site will survive and grow without committed new users. We have what, like 18,000 articles now, and probably most are crap. How many does wikipdeia have again? Like, infinity-million? And relatively few of them seem to be crap. If you want a good wiki, sometimes you have to get a little dirty, it seems . . .
--Hrodulf 15:42, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
I think my template changes weren't retroactive to the pages I already edited. Oh well, at least the n00bs will get the links from now on. Thanks for the idea, and the interest in the project.--Hrodulf 15:47, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Actually, it did work! I got confused because I was looking at user pages that I actually typed a message on, not linked to the templates (it took me a bit to think of doing that) Neato. --Hrodulf 16:01, 27 May 2006 (UTC).
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